NIKOLAI BEILHARZ, HOST: Kristy McBain is the Federal Emergency Services Minister and is with us this afternoon. Minister, good afternoon.

KRISTY MCBAIN, MINISTER FOR EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT: Good afternoon.

HOST: Can I start actually with a text message that someone's just sent through – Lyn who says, ‘as older people in our 70s, we really do rely on having access to Triple-0 if an emergency presents. I'm now feeling most unsure of this service being reliable and we're not Optus customers. This company must face the consequences, whatever that may be’. How worried are you that people's trust in Triple-0 may be eroded as a result of what's happened?

MCBAIN: Yeah, I can completely understand Lyn's sentiments and you know, hearing your listener Kirsty, this morning about her experience with it, I mean, it's incredibly distressing and people have a right to feel outraged about what's happened. It's unacceptable, and it should be a rite of passage if someone calls Triple-0 in their time of need that they should be able to get through. Optus has let down their customers not only this time, but obviously also in 2023. They need obviously to fix their processes. But ACMA will be investigating and we'll wait for the outcome of that, but have no doubt that they should be facing significant penalties.

HOST: How clear a picture do you feel you have of what happened and how it unravelled over the course of Thursday and Friday? Because it feels like there's just every couple of hours a new piece of information emerges that maybe Optus had not passed on in the first instance.

MCBAIN: Yeah, I don't think that there's a clear picture yet from what actually happened in Optus. And as you said, there's new details emerging, you know, every other hour about what actually took place. What we do know is that Optus didn't follow their protocols and alert emergency authorities in any state or territory. They didn't alert the National Situation Room that is run by the Federal Government and unfortunately their redundancy mechanism didn't kick in. So Optus has got some serious explaining to do. Under Australian law, telco providers must provide access to emergency calling and that didn't happen. So, I'm really interested to see what ACMA’s investigation we'll uncover and we'll go from there.

HOST: Is there still a question around whether or not some of that was systems failure, as in what should have happened, didn't happen, or whether or not some of that failure to pass on information may have been intentional or self-aware?

MCBAIN: Look, we're unsure of that, but whether it's systems failure or whether it's the company, you know, not wanting to pass on information that will all be part of that investigation that ACMA is doing. What is clear, though, is that Optus have not lived up to their contract with their customers, they have not instilled confidence in their brand, and they've got consumers now who are, you know, rightly concerned about their viability going forward as a provider of telco services for parts of our community.

HOST: We've heard from the Greens Senator Sarah Hanson-Young today saying that your colleague, the Communications Minister, has the power to appoint an independent technical expert to oversee Optus Triple-0 capacity and that it just requires Cabinet sign-off so it could be done quickly. Is that something that will be considered?

MCBAIN: Look, right now our focus is on getting to the bottom of what went wrong before we determine the consequences that will be applied to Optus. As I said, ACMA will be investigating and we'll wait to see what happens there. But we will look at any additional measures that we may need to take in the future.

HOST: And what would you say to people who are thinking about Triple-0 and thinking, should I be less certain than maybe I was two weeks ago?

MCBAIN: Look, Triple-0 and our emergency responders provide a fabulous service to our community, whether that's in times of medical issues or in times of natural disaster, in times of accidents that happen, you can have faith in our emergency responders and the work that they do. And what I don't want to see is anyone taking out their anger or their frustration on Optus’ failure on any of our emergency service personnel. But it is important that Optus now reviews its procedures and makes sure that its customers can continue to have faith that they will always have access to Triple-0 calling.

HOST: Minister, thank you for your time this afternoon.

MCBAIN: Great to be with you.