Senator the Hon Anthony Chisholm
Transcript - Doorstop - Kangaroo Bus Lines - Burpengary, Qld
ANTHONY CHISHOLM [ASSISTANT MINISTER]: It's good to be with you in Longman and thanks also to Darren and Brisbane Bus Lines for hosting this – a company that if you grew up in south east Queensland, I'm sure you've ridden on one of their buses before and they have a great reputation. Obviously, safety, when it comes to the bus industry, is really important. We've seen too many tragedies in recent years that have impacted families and communities across the country. As a Federal Government, we want to ensure that safety is of the utmost importance and work constructively with industry to implement changes that are going to make a difference. As we just saw on that bus there, they've retrofitted seatbelt warnings, so reminding people to put their seatbelt on. And also having signs on their seat when they sit down to put their seatbelt on. That's something that we've designed as part of these new Australian Design Rules that will be implemented across the country. So they'll apply to new buses from 1 November 2026, and then existing models from 1 November 2027. I want to thank the bus industry for working constructively with us on this. These are important changes that are going to add to the safety of Australian buses, and therefore, passengers and families. We know we're a big country. We know that people have to use buses to get around, whether it be for work, whether it be catching up with family and loved ones, or indeed, for recreation as well. So I think that these changes will be welcomed. They're important. And I wanted to thank Tony and the bus industry for working with the Federal Government to bring these changes to bear. I'll hand over to Tony to say a few words now.
TONY HOPKINS [BIC CHAIR]: Thanks, mate. Good morning. Tony Hopkins, I’m the chair of the Bus Industry Confederation for Australia. We represent operators, suppliers, associate providers, and a few of the jurisdictions that we also operate in are members of the BIC. The BIC role is about improving safety for passengers and operators and drivers, and we see this ADR as a positive, very positive step. It’s another tool that we're able to use for bus safety. Surprisingly, if you get in an aeroplane, you put on your seatbelt, if you get in a car, you put on your seatbelt. But if you get in a bus with seatbelts fitted, you're only likely to get 7 per cent of people put the seatbelt on in a seatbelt for the bus. So this is an education process. It's about trying to change the society acceptance that seatbelts should be worn when they're fitted in a bus. This ADR is a great step. It's a great improvement. And the Bus Industry Confederation would like to thank the government, the Albanese Government, and indeed the senator for his works and the government for supporting and working with industry to get this ADR through and approved. With that, I'll hand back.
JOURNALIST: Tony, can I just ask you initially, has it been an expensive exercise for the company to retrofit?
HOPKINS: Look, if we're going to retrofit, we're looking at around about $2,500, I believe, to fit from scratch. Of course, it'll be more cost effective once they're put into fit of the new buses. It's always easier and more cost effective to fit in a new build. But when you look at the trade-off for it, as I say, it's another tool, just ensuring the safety. There were [inaudible]…
JOURNALIST: Is it covering your entire fleet?
HOPKINS: Some of the fleet won't be able to be fitted because some of the fleet- You can still actually acquire a bus in Australia in some states without seatbelts being mandatory to be fitted. And I'm not talking low-floor, I'm talking high-floor. The industry is working with state jurisdictions on that, trying to make it that a high-floor bus should be seatbelt-fitted. So, if it's got seatbelts, it's not as hard to retrofit, but of course, without seatbelts, no point putting that technology in.
JOURNALIST: Is it adequate that many buses won't have these new safety features simply because they don't have seatbelts?
HOPKINS: It's not adequate. However, there's a process one has to go through. It's not a simple matter of fitting seats with seatbelts in some buses. So these seats are normally attached to the chassis or a support mechanism that runs down the centre of the bus, and to fit the seatbelt-fitted seats into a bus isn't just as simple as changing the seats out. Structurally, you might have to change all the infrastructure. The retirement age can be 20 or 25 years, depending on the state jurisdiction. So it's a process. But as mentioned before, this is a great step because everything that gets built after a certain date with seatbelts will have these warning systems, and the industry is working towards seatbelts being fitted in all high-floor buses that are built and delivered in Australia as soon as practicable.
JOURNALIST: People travelling in buses may think, hearing that, that the bus can have a 25-year lifetime, but there’s gaping holes in this.
HOPKINS: Yeah, look, there are gaping holes, but it was the same when seatbelts were adopted for long-distance. So a coach has to be seatbelt-fitted, and there were a number of mechanisms put in place around that. There was, from a certain date, a bus that was going to be used for long-distance had to be fitted with seatbelts. The existing buses were given a reduced lifespan of 15 years where you couldn’t go on a one way direction of more than 350 kilometres. So there were mechanisms put in place by the regulators, if you like. So, it’s surprising, with industry working with government, we will be able to address this issue much quicker.
JOURNALIST: As a bus operator, would you like to see other safety features incorporated with the buses or the system?
HOPKINS: No. We will always find that nothing's ever [indistinct]. [Inaudible]… so there’s always more safety protocols that are coming through. And as I say, the challenge for the industry and the challenge for government is that because of the age of the fleet, you just can't keep replacing buses every 12 months. There is an investment and there has to be a return on that investment. But if we embrace and accept that there has to be change and we've got to work collaboratively together, this shows that we can when we put our mind to it. So there's always more technology we can use. You know, there’s technology that can be put in these buses where you can have a screen that will show you if someone's sitting in a seat and they haven't fitted their seatbelt. It can tell the driver. However, what does the driver do with that knowledge once he's been told that because we don't want a driver in conflict with a passenger. Because the driver is there to keep the bus on the road, drive safely, he really- or she, rather, can't be concerned with trying to police seatbelts on the bus. And the driver will normally do an announcement. And with this enhanced announcement, this technology, we're hoping that the education process will drive operators, spend a lot of money going into schools, educating schoolchildren about the need to wear seatbelts when seatbelts are fitted as well. So, as an industry, government jurisdictions, I think we keep working towards that one outcome, which is safe travel for everybody. Will we ever get there? You mix human and machines, you’re not always going to get there, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't keep trying to mitigate this.
JOURNALIST: In terms of drivers, I suppose it's all well and good to have these safety measures, but does more accountability need to be placed on drivers for actually policing the rules?
HOPKINS: No, I don't believe so and the reason I say I don't believe so, the driver's got a lot of things to deal with. If he or she are trying to police people wearing seatbelts, other than reminding people to put their seats and seatbelts on, seatbelts being fitted, the warning loop, the voice-over loop and the signs, I don't think we can put that responsibility or liability back on the drivers. The drivers are responsible and liable for enough. You know, this is a 61-seat bus. At any one time, they can have 61 lives, including their own, in their own hands. They've got a lot of responsibility to think about already. They shouldn't have to police what is a safety device that's been put in for the wellbeing and safety of the passengers.
JOURNALIST: Just one for the Senator. The families of those affected by the Hunter Valley bus crash say that it's not enough and every bus passenger should have access to a seatbelt. What's your view on that? Are there plans to address that?
CHISHOLM: Obviously, when it comes to safety on buses, we'll continue to work with industry and those who've been impacted by bus tragedy. I've met with some of the participants who've been advocating following the Hunter Valley crash. I certainly understand their passion and the drive that they've brought to this. We'll continue to work with the industry and those who are impacted. As Tony said, there is a lot of ongoing work that can take place. This is one step that I think is important, that will be recognised by the people who use buses and their families, but we want to ensure that bus safety continues to be something that is, for the rest of the world to look upon Australia, to see that we do have a safe system. We want to ensure that continues to be the case.
JOURNALIST: Shouldn't buses that can't be retrofitted simply be given a certain deadline to be off the road to make this a foolproof safety measure, Senator?
CHISHOLM: Well, the way the Australian Design Rules work is they implement them for new and existing models, which is what we've done here. We will obviously continue to work with industry across the country to ensure that we have the best possible safety practices in place. Tony talked through some of the challenges that we have with the fleet, where a lot of buses are in services for a long period of time, but we want to set the standard, and that's what this is about. That's why I think it's important for the country.
JOURNALIST: How long are you expecting it to be before these new measures, given that they're sort of just being put in place, are able to sort of show results, I suppose?
CHISHOLM: Yeah. So for new vehicles, new models, it will be from 1 November 2026. And for new versions of existing models, it will be 1 November 2027 that they’ll have to be implemented. What this will mean is that it'll be similar to when you jump on an aircraft where you get those warnings. That's what we want to see. It's become standard now for people when they're on a flight to put their seatbelt on. We want that to be the same for buses. That's hopefully where we’ll get to. But you can't take it for granted, and that's why it's important that we work constructively with the industry to achieve that.
JOURNALIST: Just finally, will the Federal Bus Safety Working Group continue to convene or be made permanent?
CHISHOLM: That was set up in response to some of the issues that we've talked about. So they won't continue on, but we want to work constructively with those people who've been part of it. It's been a good body that has delivered results, and I'll continue to liaise with members of the industry and those people who've made up the working group in coming years. Thanks everyone.