ASHLEIGH RAPER, CO-HOST: The government has made no secret that it wants to take on the tech giants over social media. But what about dating apps?

DENHAM HITCHCOCK, CO-HOST: Two years ago, it put in place a voluntary code for online dating platforms to crack down on bad behaviour on their apps. And it seemed like a set-and-forget solution.

[Excerpt]

RAPER: Minister, we've heard from women who've lost hundreds of thousands of dollars from being scammed by men on dating apps. Another woman has been murdered by a man she met on a dating app. It's been two years since the government made the big announcement about the implementation of the Code of Conduct for online dating service providers. Do you think it's made dating online safer?

MINISTER FOR COMMUNICATIONS ANIKA WELLS: I think the voluntary code was a worthy initiative, but in reality it's been patchy at best for Australian women. That's why I want to see Australian laws that better mitigate the risks that they are facing online.

RAPER: Is that you acknowledging that the government was wrong to think that you could rely on the companies running these dating platforms to enforce the rules?

WELLS: This is an industry that has been fairly unregulated for its existence, and I don't think that's good enough when we have the research in now about what- and the real stories that you are exploring, Ash, about what Australian women are facing online.

RAPER: The new Digital Duty of Care Bill, it's passed the lower house, it's yet to go before the Senate. There's been a lot of focus on social media when we've been talking about that bill. What does it do for dating apps?

WELLS: The Digital Duty of Care will apply to all online services, whether that be games for children, whether that be social media, whether that be Meta glasses, and whether that be dating apps. That's because if you build it, you should be responsible for its risks. And when the kinds of risks you are seeing happen to Australian women are happening on these apps, they should take responsibility for it and they should be penalised if it continues to occur.

RAPER: What's your view of having verification of ID for people on dating apps?

WELLS: So look, we are through the social media ban, working with tech platforms on age verification processes and it’s an evolving form. But in this space it's something that we work with state and territories on. Ultimately individuals need to be responsible for their crimes online.

RAPER: Do you think it could possibly make it safer? People involved in romance scams believe that if their identity was verified, it wouldn't happen.

WELLS: Look, I understand that this is something that Australian women are suffering online and that they want to see remedies, they want to see consequences. I completely get that. As the Minister for Communications, the best thing I can do is create a world leading law.

RAPER: Dannielle Finlay-Jones was murdered by a man that she met on a dating app. Her mother, Jackie, is calling for mandatory police checks for people on dating apps and also a ban on people who have being convicted of DV offences. That sounds reasonable to most people, don't you think?

WELLS: I understand that people want to see justice and people want to see remedies and people want to see this never happen again. And as the Communications Minister, the best thing I can do is put in place some basic safety standards that apply to this industry.

RAPER: But what changes from that? Tech companies under the Digital Duty of Care could face fines up to $100 million for not complying with the new rules under the Digital Duty of Care. We're a year down the track from the social media ban for under-16s and there's been no fines for tech companies when you said yourself that tech companies are taking the mickey and not working hard enough to implement that. Are you failing at enforcement here?

WELLS: The Digital Duty of Care is a holistic law. It moves the whole onus of responsibility from people like the carers, friends, family of victims of harm online to the onus of responsibility being on the shoulders of the tech companies, they need to prevent it before it occurs.

RAPER: What do you say to people on dating apps, especially women? Do you think it's safe for them to be on a dating app?

WELLS: I'm saying that I'm working as hard as I can to get a digital duty of care in place to require basic safety standards online so that the risks that you are currently facing, someone in the tech platforms have to identify them and mitigate against them before anyone ever comes near you and causes you harm.

RAPER: Anika Wells, thank you.

WELLS: Pleasure.